Often, we find that customers will either be prohibited in some way or have some restriction placed on them, whether it’s SEO or a functionality that they need, and that’s when they’ll start looking to either modernize or move completely away from some of the proprietary-based systems.

And now, that’s usually where we come in is they started with wicks because they just needed to get something on the line.

This episode is brought to you by Mosaic data services. Moi is a leader and managed WordPress hosting analytics in all things website.

Their goal is to keep you focused on your business and not the distractions of a website so that you can reach your true potential if you’re in need of hosting a website redesign or an SSL certificate. Please reach Jason by using Maida services dot com or calling 2403993900.Let them know you heard about them on the prospect. So welcome back to the prospecting show. Today we have Jason back in, Josh Martin on the show. Thanks for coming by guys.

Sure, thanks for having us.

Absolutely, so to start things off, let’s get a lay of the land and get an understanding of what you guys do. Tell us a little bit about Mosaic and what you guys do as a company.

Sure, well, mosaic is primarily a cloud services provider, and to that end, we do quite a wide variety of things to help mostly small and mid-sized businesses manage their online presence, things ranging from web hosting and web development to email management, security, and pretty much anything that plugs into the internet that a small business would typically rely on for communications or our marketing themselves digitally.

So I see Moses been around for 20 years.

Most of that time has been spent working directly with internet-related services, and more recently now we focus on more of the marketing stuff, we have a… Most of our customers are in WordPress, so we have a very strong experience with WordPress and we’re pressed-based applications and then… Well, we’re doing a lot of analytics and hosting, as I mentioned, and some of the other things that would go into supporting small businesses, their web presence in the outward marketing that goes on for that. So been around a while, been doing this a long time, and that’s good reputation in the market, primarily regionally as it relates to web hosting and web development services, and for a small business, a lot of these companies that you guys service and ones that we service as well, in our business or have been around for a little bit, so they have a website typically when they start, and they maybe came to this point where they’ve been business three to five years and they’re looking to start spending some money effort in time growing their brand, so what could they do with… What do you guys recommend to take someone from a square space or a non-managed hosting kind of environment and bring them into something that’s WordPress, that’s a little more reliable, that has better SEO capability, like how would they make that transition?

We find that a lot of folks, when they’re first starting up, we’ll find sort of the easiest and oftentimes the least expensive way to get their shingle out there, to get their presence up on the Internet, and pretty short order to… They find that they’re limited in some way as a result of limitations that are there with Wix or Squarespace, and they’ll start looking for other solutions that are a little bit more flexible and what they can do and how they can do it, and often that will lead them to WordPress.

So the customers we deal with many, most of them or have been around a while, and we’re often helping them modernize their site, maybe they’ve had their site for five years or so, and they’re looking to just freshen it up or… And sometimes we are dealing with startups that are looking to put their best foot forward right on day one, and we’re gonna listen to their needs and figure out what it is they’re trying to accomplish with their web presence, but the fact that WordPress has been around for so long, it drives a near 50% of all websites on the internet or word press-oriented, it has a huge community, and so we find that it will often, especially for small and mid-sized businesses who are not looking to do anything really exotic will serve the purpose perfectly, it’s non-proprietary, it’s supported by a large community, and so there are many resources available to people to engage it and to maintain it and carry it forward and use it for a long time, where some of the more proprietary platforms like Wix and Squarespace or they’re sort of in a box.

And as long as you fit in the box, things are good, but often we find that customers will either be prohibited in some way or have some restriction placed on them, and whether it’s so or a functionality that they need, and that’s when they’ll start looking to either modernize or move completely away from some of the proprietary-based systems, and now that’s usually where we come in is they started with wicks because they just need to get something on the Internet, they needed to get some representation no matter how small and ineffective. And now their business has been around, they’re ready to invest in those new tools, and that’s what WordPress opens the tool box up to where we can have a lot more functionality and turning the website into more than just a business card. It doesn’t just have to be that representation that’s simple, like, Okay, I have a website because I have to have a website, and that’s the end of it, and at the end of it, they wanna use the website… There’s a tool to drive Brees. Yeah, whether it’s e-commerce or analytics or membership management, whatever the case may be, just you can just finding the company so that they’ll pick up the phone and start the business relationship better.

Yeah, and what are your guys thoughts on… There’s no like this dichotomy that I’ve seen, at least with working with these different small businesses, there’s two thoughts that I’ve heard of, and one is a multi-page website, you gotta tartan dart like five-page website, home about maybe services, contact us and some other page, but then you also have these landing page style, strong call to action with maybe just a video and some sales copy. Do you guys see that companies are requesting one over the other in 2020 here, or is that something that’s still kind of like people want five-page websites, the fiber or the single Pascale action is more either just starting a brand or for a single poem Pain campaign yeah, the sort of five page a beginners, that is, is the entry level at this point really, a lot of our clients end up with much bigger sites than that because as soon as they see everything that a website can do… It’s like, Oh, I didn’t even know we could have an events calendar, I didn’t know we could sell our products right through the website, let’s build this out, let’s do thing, this is great. They didn’t realize how easy it would be to set that up, relatively speaking.

Yeah, and so the five-page website is sort of the baseline and things… It’s sort of evolved from there. There is a trend now for single-scrolling pages, especially design as it relates to mobile, obviously more and more people now are engaging websites from their mobile device, whether it’s a tablet or a phone or whatever, so it’s critical that whatever presence you have works both on the desktop and a an, a mobile device, whatever that may be, and for that reason, there has been a trend for companies to use long scrolling home pages as a replacement for the typical five-page site, it still has all of the same content.

It’s just organized in a way that someone can scroll down the page to that to act that content rather than having to follow a menu or a navigation system to do the same thing.

So there has been a trend for that, and it’s largely based on the fact that people are engaging sites from mobile, and it’s just simpler, frankly, for people to scroll a site that way.

So there is a trend to that, but then when you expand the site, as Josh mentioned, You know I… It’s often for marketing campaigns will create landing pages or integrations like eCommerce or membership management or events calendars and things like that, and those are also done with mobile in mind, but we’ll often add depth to the site beyond the typical five page or five sections on a single scrolling page for a web presence.

That’s right.

And when you guys are taking a site from square space or one of these other providers or somebody maybe is hard code their own side, or maybe even a WordPress site, one of the things I see a lot and it’s a turnoff is the missing SSL. And I think this is an interesting topic because a lot of people look at their site, they’re happy with it from a visual standpoint, but then they forget two critical things, you gotta have an SSL and you gotta have some kind of SEO effort. If you wanna actually rank for it, so what are you guys thoughts on those two pieces?

So SSL, absolutely 100%. Gotta have it these days.

Last year or two years ago, Google started really pushing for everyone on the web to use SSL on their websites, just blanket… Everybody have to have it. There used to be a real, real high bar, both financially and technologically, even five years ago, there were a lot of limitations in terms of implementing SSL, and a lot of those barriers have really come down, there are some great providers like… There’s the non-profit organization, lets and Crip that provides free SSL certificates.

And if you, for one reason or another site needs a different kind of certificate, the prices have come down, but also the limitations from the web server side have also come down, so it’s much easier to implement them, it’s much easier to update them, and the websites themselves every website we build, when we build a well at 10% with over HTTPS, so it’s always gonna show fully secure, but even when we go look at those older sites that weren’t built that way from the beginning, the method for switching site… An existing site, so that it’s using an SSL certificate for properly is much simpler than it used to be even converted to a few years ago.

So again, it’s putting tools in the tool box, WordPress makes it very easy to do it right from the beginning, but also to convert a site that an older site that wasn’t built to be fully utilizing us all to flip it over so that it will… And then you get that little bit of boost there in just it protects the visitors to the site was a… Every week, you hear about data compromises, and this is one element of it, it’s not the only element by any means, but it’s one element of protecting the data that your visitors are giving to your site is to use that SSL certificate because it fully in crypts. The conversation back and forth between the visitor and the web server… Right, and it’s often a catalyst for modernization mobile site that’s not mobile-friendly, will often be a catalyst, what someone will call and say, Hey, we have a site, but it’s not mobile friendly. Can you help us from it, the… Our site is beautiful, like Josh said, but it’s not running over HPS, can you help us resolve that? Things like that will often be catalyst to modernization and then having remedy those issues, you get lots of benefits then on the back end through the analytics and SEO, like you mentioned, optimization for us is more a game of visibility than it is purely Optimizing a site, we’re looking to, oftentimes, improve the visibility of a site overall and not just focus on on site keywords or things like that, but looking at it in a more big picture way and using analytics to drive the decisions that are made for how a site will be engaged, whether it’s coming through social media or directly through the search engines or wherever the traffic may come from, all of these things play into that success of a website being more visible and more engaging for the end user.

Yeah, and it’s kind of a good topic too, because people have to think about their site from three different ways, where they gotta look the visual component of it, then they gotta look at the security and technical component of it, and then they gotta look at ranking when you guys are building sites, you kinda start to finish a new project, do you guys kinda work on the visual, the technical and the SEO at the same time, or do you try and tackle two of those and work on one later… What’s that look like? Typically, we build on all three from the beginning, you sort of… You have to loosen you… You don’t wanna be in a situation where you’re so focused on how something looks that you’re willing to disregard security in IT, security concerns or build it up so high in one area that you can’t touch the others without breaking something out with a…

I thought our philosophy is, now one of these is more essential than the other, they’re all essential, what good is a higher ranking site if you get hacked?


Well, that’s a very good segue into the next component, which is… Let’s talk about that. From a hacking standpoint, a lot of people have the opportunity to build a great site, it looks good, technically, it’s decent, it has good SEO, but then there’s no one managing it, there’s no plug and updates, there’s no WordPress updates, there’s no real ESL sometimes missing. Right, so what does somebody get going from a shared hosting platform to a managed hosting platel, all of those things, and the idea of managed hosting is something that we’ve been promoting and integrating into our hosting packages for years. Now, I think we were ahead of the curve on that. And really what it does is it helps small businesses and mid-sized businesses who don’t have a dedicated marketing team or web master, for example, that can go in and consistently keep things up to… We provide that service effectively, we have a team of folks who monthly, on a routine, regular basis, will go in and ensure that the security is up to-date, that plugins have been updated, things are being managed properly, so there is no or very little possibility for a site to be compromised in any way, whether it’s brute force, where they’re trying to log in through the admin area and take control of the site or through SQL injections or other things that you see or hear about from time to time.

The managed hosting prevents that, and we even go so far as to guarantee it, if we’re managing someone’s side and for whatever reason it’s compromised, it doesn’t eliminate the possibly somebody going in and just randomly deleting something or doing something silly. And for that, we have backups integrated into all of our hosting packages too, so that there’s always a fall back, but if something were to happen in the context of manage hosting, we will take ownership of that and get the site back to a normally functioning place and then figure out what it is that was vulnerable and resolve that as well, so it gives small business owners a piece of mind that their site is being properly maintained, even though they don’t have someone on staff necessarily to handle it directly.

And I would say 75%, 80%, maybe more, of the sites that we deal with that are Act not the manage sites, but folks who come to us and say, Help my site got hacked, as I have been hosted with some other provider for years and years, in my site at hack, we’ll go in and we’ll see. First thing we’ll see as well, none of the software has been updated for three years, five years, it’ll be so out of date, Well, of course, it’s been hacked because you haven’t updated anything years, and every one of these programs is full of holes that in… And hacker can wander by and take control of your site, and that’s what the managed hosting takes off the table is that space where the software can get old and break down, or just vulnerabilities will be discovered and explain any… And the publisher of that particular piece of software will put out a patch, but if you don’t apply the patch, you’re sitting, you’re sitting doctor, you’re just waiting to get it back and I… And that’s why we’re so confident that we do say 100% your site will not get hacked, and if it… In those rare cases, I can… There was one incident, I think, two and a half years ago, where we have a… There was a zero… What’s called a zero-day attack, where a flaw was discovered in a commonly used plug-in and it was started to be exploited immediately, like same-day discovered, and so it was a race between the publisher of the plug-in to get the patch out and the hackers who were trying to exploit it, and we had, I think one or two sites actually get exploited in that because there was no patch available students, it was Edith rolled him back, clean them up. All taken care of, that was just part of our service because we were watching over the site and we knew, Okay, all of these sites to use this particular bug and we got a patch, a wall today, we gotta run through every single one of these two day or they’re gonna get attacked.

Yeah, and that’s really a good kind of concept to have to it, ’cause a lot of people look at that and say, well, managed hosting is gonna cost more than a traditional standard hosting, but if you just went here math on this and looked at the effort that would be involved the fixed a shared hosting account versus your somewhat nominal increase in price for a shared hosting… Sorry, for managed hosting, it’s almost always gonna be better to go with a managed service, it sounds like when you look at the cost of 10, 20, 30 hours of development, fixes it at a correct assessment.

It is, and there’s also the rolling effect of those costs, if you’re sighted down for a week while it has to be rebuilt because you’re hosting provider doesn’t have any backups in your site was trash, and I… How much business are you losing in that time, how much business isn’t gonna come back because they search for you, they found your down and they moved on to the next person who does what you do, right? So it’s not just the immediate cost of rebuilding, it is that snetterto lost that carry-on effect. It’s almost opportunity cost, right? You Orsini to sell stuff, but you can’t tell off on your e-commerce platform, ’cause again, like you said, you’re down. If you sell 100 a day or whatever, down for five days, you just lost five grand on top of the fact that you got your development fees to have to put this all back in place, and that’s really big for a small business. If you have a small business that’s, let’s say, on a even or less, having that kind of impact financially could be huge when it’s almost like an insurance policy, it… Why not people buy life insurance, disability insurance, things like that, the car insurance, but they’re not always thinking about that in terms of the website to say, Listen, let’s ensure what we’ve built so that the long-term cost… Yes, it’s a little bit more each month, but that premium raised price is gonna be so much better than paying out the penalty.

That’s right. Yeah. And most people will understand that. That’s a good analogy, and most people understand it just like that, it’s… The penny-wise and pound foolish. kind of thing. So yeah, it’s been an effective hosting platform for us because it makes it easier for us to manage these things and for them because it takes away that risk of bad things happening that are unexpected, so it’s a win-win. No doubt about it.

Yeah, and if we kind of switch and talk about the flip side of it, you guys talked about hosting, talk about some of the customers, small business owners, entrepreneurs that would benefit from you guys, what about the designers and developers, there’s lots of those people out there that… Have hundreds of choices for hosting or a managed service or SEO or whatever it is. Why is it that… What would somebody get with coming to Mosaic from a designer or developer, tampine, what additional benefits are there to work with you guys, I think offer them a safety net to some degree, a lot of developers and designers are not as in tune with the infrastructure that’s required to make their design and development efforts work to the best of their ability, and we can provide that expertise to designers and developers to not only help them avoid the pitfalls that they may experience otherwise, but give them, I guess, a piece of mind in that we’re gonna be able to provide the infrastructure and the support necessary to keep the site running its best over the long haul, and there are a lot of things that factor into that. Hosting is certainly one of them.

Domain Name management is another big piece of that, DNS, the effective routing of traffic over the internet, how your DNS is set up and where your email is routed versus your website and other things that are related to traffic going back and forth.

SSL was one of those things that we’ve already talked about. So you would be surprised how many designer, small business owners own a domain name or have their site on a particular domain, but they don’t know who owns it or or may not even own it, so we can help them manage the details of those things very efficiently. And effectively and help them so that they’re not having to worry about, once the site is built, is it gonna… Where are we gonna put it? How is it gonna run? Is it gonna function the way I expect because we can address all of those things during that time, during the development, in design process, and then put it into a situation where it’s going to run at its best for… And definitely… And where do you see… Sorry, but God, Joshua, for the designers and developers who don’t have the sort of the server knowledge, like Jason was saying, we see it, we look at the whole field from the very beginning of the first idea, so well after the site of launched… So if they’re just focused on, Okay, I’ve got this great design for this new brand, I’m gonna build a fantastic website, and I have no idea what to do next, having a reliable partner for that, a lot of the designers that we work with on a routine basis, that’s why they keep coming back to us is they say, I’ve been building these sites and then I had no idea what to do next, but you guys know what to do next, so I can just say, Okay, here’s a website, it’s built… You guys pick it up from here, and then that also becomes added value for their clients where they can say, you know, Hey, we’re gonna do this site, you gotta… Like you were talking about with the insurance policy, you wanna make sure that this site that you’ve just invested three, four, five, 10000 in is gonna run well, it’s gonna be protected for years and years, and I’ve got the team of moat take care of it for you.

Yeah, and I think that that’s important for people to understand, you have to be willing to spend the time to get things done, right? Especially if you’re gonna do a website every, let’s say three to five years, if you might as well make it right now so that people can use it and not really have to worry so much about doing a full re-brand in a full redevelopment… I guess I should say of the site in a year because… You didn’t take the extra steps. Right, that’s right.

So what about the future of development in the hosting and websites, where do you guys see things going over the next one to three years?

That’s a good question.

Web development is such a complicated and somewhat subjective thing, we see the evolution of the Wickes in the square space that do-it-yourself type things, those things will continue to evolve and to some degree, make the process of standing up a website easier for someone that’s just getting started, but there are so many things that are involved in putting a site together that I don’t know that they’ll ever be able to sort of do everything. So I imagine that we’ll see continued refinement and sophistication come from the sort of proprietary platforms like Wix and Squarespace, certainly WordPress will continue to evolve as it has over the last 15 years, I think largely… I don’t know that it’s gonna change that much, really, I think what’ll happen is you’ll have… With sort of the migration to mobile, those are the sorts of things that impact us the most, will there be other devices that come along, which need to be accounted for in the development… In the design process, I think the platform will largely remain the same, it’s really how… How we have to adjust to accommodate different screen resolutions with 4K and 8K and the evolution of high definition, what will it will change in that regard? It relates to design and development, things like that, video is certainly another big component of design now, more and more sites are moving away from static content and going toward animation and graphic, a video integration, so there will certainly be that element to… Yeah, I think being able to build a site that looks just as good and just as engaging on a 4 screen as on a cell phone screen, that’s a challenge that is not a… It’s not an obvious thing where you just shrink it down, it does take a thought to… You really have to almost not quite, but almost double your work because they lay out that looks good on the big screen, isn’t what’s going to look good and be engaging and keep folks on your site and engaging with your site on a mobile platform and more so traffic is being driven by mobile visitors. I think the other thing that’s going to come to a head in the next couple of years is the war between advertisers and ad blockers, that for me personally, when I’m surfing on my phone, and I come up to a page where it’s so choked with ad that I can’t even browse for the little bit of content I want, I think that is going to… Folks are gonna have to start delivering more quality content that can pay for itself without having to rely on advertising, and I think also the advertisers are gonna get better at vetting ad blockers because they’re already doing that. So I think that little bit of the fight is going to progress in an interesting way over the next couple of years… Yeah, for sure.

And analytics to analytics is becoming a very big part of what we do, and so as part of that, but it’s really more than… It’s really understanding the data that’s being a… Websites are data machines, and whether the people realize they’re not, there are so much data that can be taken from the traffic that comes back and forth to your website and then used and understood to help drive marketing efforts, help drive and make you… Help drive decision making to be more intelligent about, I owe who’s coming to the site, where the landing… How are they engaging us? So we’ve really focused a lot of energy, especially in the last 12 months or more, so to farming that data, being able to harness it and use it and provide it back to the customers and the small businesses that we work with, so that they can use it in a meaningful way and help expand and fine-tune their sites so that it’s sort of engaging the right folks and delivering the right message.

And to kind of wrap things up here, how would somebody reach out to me, what’s the best way for them to find out more about managed hosting, some development services, you guys, some of that analytics, so they could learn a little bit more, how could they reach you guys.

Well, certainly, they can come to our website, our website is mosaic data services dot com. It certainly talks about all of the services that we provide, we offer a number of ways to directly communicate, whether through email or even a live chat, we have the ability for someone to engage us through live chat on our website, and also just over the phone, we love talking to people, and we encourage people to ask questions, and I don’t… Unlike the big boy hosting providers that are out there, where it takes a half hour just to find somebody that you can talk with that understands what you’re shooting for, you call, pick up the phone, whether it’s myself or Josh or whoever on the team that ends up talking to you on the other end, we’re happy to answer questions and I figure things out with folks, and not even necessarily, because there are customer as they may just be curious about how something works or whatever the case, so… Yeah, we encourage people to ask questions. We are often out speaking and talking to folks about different topics, whether it’s security or the benefits of backing things up, or your domain or whatever, a lot of the things we covered here, just to help them be more aware of what’s going on.

And then you get down to it, we… We, our entire company of nerds, and you’re all huge nerds, and we love what we do, there’s no one on here who on our team who’s like, I gotta go work in the salt mines. We all got into this because we like it, and we like talking about it, so if you have questions, get on live chat, get on, get on the phone, shoot us an email, ’cause you’re gonna give us a chance to show up how cool our stuff is, it’s right in.

Well, I appreciate both your guys time today and talking about some really valuable pieces for small business owners and designers and developers of Light, and I hope we get some great listener feedback on the session.

 Yeah, love it. Happy to be part of this and we look forward to hearing the responses that we get someone… For sure. I really pretty even is

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