Welcome back to The prospecting show. Today is May 28, Thursday 1-08 Eastern here with Paris. Gani, how are you today?


Doing well, how are you?


Very good, thank you. So kind to start the show off, well, one of the things I always like to ask people of is give us your story, give us the five-minute or less of where you came from, what you’re doing now, and kinda what your business is.


Yes, absolutely. Thank you very much for having me on the show.


Yeah, I’m originally a native of Pakistan, I was born in England, and I grew up in Cincinnati, so I at a pretty multi-cultural background, it all my degrees and education here in the Cincinnati, Ohio area. I started off in the finance industry, completed my MBA, and then got into the healthcare field, I was always a little bit into the healthcare field as my got physicians and health care administrators throughout my family, and that kind of threw me towards towards that, toward that industry.


But I’ve worked for multiple hospital systems here in the Cincinnati area, and then had an opportunity to live and move and live in the Middle East, specifically in Dubai, in Saudi Rabia, had the opportunity to launch a number of different clinics, their various specialties. And when I moved back, I continue to contain to pursue those opportunities as a…


I work there, I still work and travel over to… To the Middle East every few months, obviously not right now because of the current crisis, so I… And then at the same time, I am also working for an organization by the name Orly, which is a residential facility for abused and underprivileged children.


Wow, that’s quite a mix you have there, so to kinda go down the pathway of the medical work to kinda break down what you guys do in that business… Absolutely. As I said, I’ve been traveling and looking for a project in the Middle East for quite some time, through some networking and connections, I was introduced to a doctor who specialized in Wound Care, diabetic wound care here in the US, and he was looking to expand his services overseas, and I recommended, let’s look at the Middle East.


And took them on a tour of Toby and in that region, and what we found out was that there was nobody truly doing any kind of diabetic wound treatment for patients in that region… No, just do by, but all of the Middle East, they were just behind not only technologically, but also from a training standpoint, and there really no wound care specialist. And what we found was that basically, if a patient had a wound, they would try to do some basic treatment and then they were just empty the Lim, and of course, our doctors and specialists here in the US, that we can… Absolutely, save those lens. And if you are familiar with any consists after a limbs amputated of that individual usually has another three to five years I left, because that infection and those issues just continue to continue to spread throughout the body, so the treatments that are… A team have come up with, and I have been the trained in heated preserve those limbs, and we have, I think, close to 90% reservation or LIMS and Oisin that results and having a normal life going over, so that’s the specialty that we started with as far as launching in that region, and then we uncovered other opportunities to… We always look for opportunities in that region where they… They just don’t have either access to where the specialists… And what we do is we… We research and we bring those specialists from the US who are highly trained and to the Middle East to help patients and the general population there.


And why did you guys come up with that kind of model? I know you said that you had… There was a deficiency there and they maybe weren’t doing things as well as you’d see in North America, but how did you come to decide that’s what you wanna do?


It was more just a… It wasn’t based on demand, we saw that there’s… Some of the specialties that exist there, and they’re doing well, orthopedics, pediatrics, and if you know the Middle East of the reason they flourish so much as they bring in very good, highly trained individuals from the West, and this was one specific specialty that just… It didn’t exist. We went to a number of different diabetic centers and nobody was doing wood care, they were doing basic and so we said we can bring in the specialty, help save lives in this region, and hopefully we can even expand those services within… Outside of the Middle East into Southeast Asia and beyond. So just that part of the world has not even touched wound care, and so we were basically the very first on stand-alone wound care… Treatment center in that part of the world.


Yeah, and it’s always interesting being one of the first… Right, in anything that people do, when you’re the first person in there, you get the risk, you got the reward, you get the scrutiny, you get all the people who are thinking you’re crazy, and then when it actually works out… People start asking the right questions, right?


How can they duplicate that or how can they re-purpose what you’re doing?


So now that you’ve had the experience and how you said you lived overseas and you’ve lived here in the US, what kind of things do you see that are different between the US culture from a healthcare standpoint and the Middle Eastern culture over there, maybe beyond just the diabetic management. A great, great question, that’s the question that’s asked often during my travels, so in the US, you have a lot of red tape with insurance companies, so I’ll just give you the positives and negatives of each of each region, everything. I think what’s happened is we’re a very litigious society here in the States, so everything is complicated, contracts, complicated legal language, over decades that’s resulted in complications for patients, they go in, they have… They have to go in for a treatment here at the hospital in the States, and what procedures are covered, what procedures are not comforted, what’s the co-pay, there’s so many different complications with the insurance system here in America, we’re in the Middle East. They’ve taken the best of what America has to offer as far as insurance offerings, and they’ve done a very good job where if you need to get an appointment with a specialist, for example, an endocrinologist, you can get it the same day, maybe next day, where in the US, it could be a week or a couple weeks out, because there are so many approvals and to the exception insurance over there, the insurance is cover everything that gonna be required of that. It’s kind of a hybrid of what the American system offers, and they localize some of the insurance services.


Which has made it a lot easier for patients to get the proper care.


The challenges in the Middle East are that they don’t… There’s on the population is 85% x Patriots, specifically in Dubai. And so only 15% of low goals as they’re called Marais, they don’t have expertise, they basically say we have the money, we’re gonna bring in all the experts on the west, and then we’ll let you… You guys set everything up, but the challenge that at Western Western physicians face is that you have the local who don’t have clinical training or the expertise that the Western westerns have, and they’re kind of saying, Well, it’s our money, so we’re gonna tell you how to run the show here, and the American doctors or the European doctors are saying, Well, that’s great. I’m glad you have money or pays well, however, we know clinically what’s best, so they tend to behead a little bit, which can make it challenging working and running hospitals and clinics in that part of the world, so there’s positives from each country, and I worked… Worked on both ends of that.


Yeah, and it… With the having a… Your foot in both sides. I think it’s interesting ’cause you probably have a unique perspective on what you feel it would be a better fit. There’s gotta be something that North America can take away from the Middle East. There’s gotta be something that the Middle East can take away from North America in terms of healthcare, and even beyond that, like all the different… Could be socio-economic things, could just financial things, there’s a lot of different trends that other parts of the world don’t even know exists.


Do you find that you are able to make more change over there or more change here in the US… Definitely more change over there, but the caveat with that is you need to know the right people, so if you are… We always talk about networking and who you know, it applies more there than anywhere else in the world, I’m a content of that.


So over there, if you… For example, because I lived there, I’ve established a very nice network, I literally connected with co, the largest insurance company in the UAE and in UDI and said, Look, we need to add some procedures that are part of the wound care process and in specialty. And how do we do that? He said, Well, there’s a step-by-step process. And I had a direct link to the CEO, put me on to this clinical team, and we were able to add those services that were brand new to the market, that were not as part of their insurance coverage and add that in the… So maybe three, four months to get it all done, but it got done where in America, I can even imagine trying to connect with the CEO of say, Anthem in healthcare and say, Oh, I need to add some services who I talk to… You’re never gonna get to that point because here you’ve got just a lot more red tape and then it’s all about the bottom line, so… And insurance companies over there are at the mercy of hospitals and the general population, and America is the other way around, everyone at the mercy of the insurance on… And that’s the really the key difference.


Yeah, and when did you start working through these projects, how long ago or how long have you actually been doing this… This kind of work, while I was working here in the States, one of my relatives based out of Adobe had encouraged me to come and visit and take a look at the healthcare system, so I started to attend the annual Arab Health Conference, and by every January I’d go there at I just to find out, Hey, do my research, makes a contact. I started that probably in 2005 or six, and I did that for almost six, seven years before I actually found the project, so I would just fly out there on my own and connect and find out what makes this market… ’cause you really have to understand the market. You anything you have… That’s one the biggest mistakes that testers make, I don’t understand that region well enough when they go to launch their business, specifically a clinic. So I did that for some time, and then once… Back in 2012, I made a great contact that kinda led me to… Was establishing a wound care centers.


Wow. And with your role right now, maybe break down what it is that you do with the Wound Center, so you have the clinical team, you have some of the management team, and then you’re here, so how are you involved with that kind of day-to-day?


Yes, I was one of the founders of the Wound Care Center on the business side, and then I collaborated with ARCOS, who’s a wound care specialist and podiatrist, and I… He and I kinda came together and I took in the business side, he obviously is hired the doctors and the established of the clinical pieces, and we came together to launch this in that region, and my role now, now that our main clinic or first clinic is not been running and we’ll continue, hopefully, once this crisis, I start to die down here, and then your future… We will go back and continue that clinic, and my role will be to continue to expand in two different countries within that region and work on medical tourism packages. So our goal is right now to have the one main clinic in DUI in an area that’s called Healthcare City, which is everything healthcare, as you can tell by the name.


And I have made connections with key individuals in India and Pakistan on Rabia guitar-Catan, looking to go beyond that, just for patients to come in as part of a healthy and a medical tourism package, and then whichever country we kinda see that looks like… There’s a large demand, we will then open, start opening up satellite clinics in those specific markets, so that’s kind of our strategy and that will be my role to do that, and are you guys all privately funded or do you have an insurance model, like how do people actually access the healthcare.


Yeah, specifically, so every market obviously has their own system, but in the UA or do viable by… They have an insurance system, so in order to live in that region, you can’t just be stare and then saying, Okay, nobody is a citizen of those confines, like you have to come there on a work mate… If you come on a work visa, then you have to have medical insurance by law, so you automatically get medical insurance, which is covered by whichever company you work for, and that covers pretty much all your required procedures and appointments and business.


Interesting, and is that model similar to the US and the fact that they have a deductible in the copay that they actually follow, or is it really… Is it structure different? Now, you said there are some differences in the way that the healthcare is actually provided, but how does the insurance work there?


Yeah, so the similarities are, they do have co-pays that they’re all very standard cope… That’s a dictatorship. So everything is run by the Royal fam.


That’s the one thing I remember, there’s no… There’s no democracy to the royal family, said, This is the way it’s gonna be done, and they always look out for ex-patriots and their own citizens, so that comes first, where I know in America, because of the red tape and complications as we kinda seeing today, patients tend to be kind of secondary and money tends to be first, so over there, it’s basically a tea… You do have a basic to paint, it’s normally not more than 10 or 15 US does that… It leans… After that, 100% college, the biggest difference between that market in the US is there’s no such thing as a concept of a claim, so if you get build, for example, 100, you will pay 100, you’re not gonna get build 500, and then… So we’re here where the doctors in the US, they bill out maybe, say 500, but then they collect 200 and the rest goes to claims and collections people, or billing, billing companies, billing companies and claims, that concept of Einstein nation, it’s basically… If you went in there, you know exactly what the fee is that what you’re gonna pay for for a surgery, for a procedure, for any kind of medical service, so if the fee schedule says 100, you’re gonna go pay 100 and you won’t be building on their dime.


That’s very interesting. And when I was practicing, I practiced here in Pittsburgh. As a chiropractor, we had the same kind of model, right, where there are some kind of co-payment or co-insurance that exists, and then you would fill out maybe a 200 visit knowing that you’re gonna get paid 125 for that service because you’re in network with Eros, shield or Etna or whatever the group is. And it’s kind of a bit of a racket because it’s, why are we not just building one-to-one, why don’t we just build on 25 instead of having to reconcile a 400 bill, that’s now 250, but the patient paid 20, so it’s really 2-30 and just it’s so complicated the way that they make it, and at the end of the day, I think it creates a lot of work, right? You could probably eliminate 50% of the payroll in insurance companies, if they just had a one, one billing, all that personnel that you have, your billing people, you have claims people, you have… You have entire industries, building companies over there. I know when you talk about a billing company that maybe what you’re talking about, a, they’re like… And it’s all fees that are published on the insurance company’s website, so tenure and all the insurance companies, they basically have similar fees, there’s very few differences, maybe certain insurance companies are cover a certain specialty more, But fees are also wooing into a doctor’s appointment. Do you know you’re gonna pay this much and not a DIN more… Well, in that transparency is really something I think America, even the Canada… To one, I know Canada’s a little bit more socialist. I grew up there, lived there for 18, 19 years. That is a more socialist model, but even there, you don’t really know what you’re gonna get all the time, you’re not necessarily financially paying for it, but there are definitely different types and levels of care that you can get depending on where you go, and there’s not really a consistent system that exists there, and… That’s definitely a valid point.


So to go back around on some of this entrepreneurship, it sounds like some of these things kind of you worked on and then the stars aligned in a bunch of stuff kinda fell together, what do you think your next venture is gonna be… You have the clinic expansion that you talked about, you what… What do you see yourself as… You’re pretty entrepreneurial. Where do you see yourself going next?


Next is a TA started about six months ago when I was out in the… Back in… Back in the fall, there was an alert who works for the Cleveland Clinic of Adobe, and she approached me and she said, You know what, I wanna launch will independent standalone allergy center, and I wanna do it. She’s not real happy and working at… And so… And she was reported to me by a common friend, and so I started that project back in January, and so we are establishing an independent allergy Center in that we’re in the middle of that, we’re establishing company and getting all the CPT codes and everything that’s health care to get it set up, we then working on… That’s actually my next venture in parallel, we’re managing the diabetic for center.


Got it. And in terms of your local work here, and you talked about, I think it was a charity or 513 at you’re working with, maybe talk a little bit about that, that the people end up listening, this can understand what your services here in the US.


Yes, yes. So the organization, it’s called Worley Children’s Home, it’s been around for about 140 years.


It has a strong connection to not name, because our CEO is a former Notre football standout who played one Lewis, 1988 championship team. So because of that, we have a nice connection to note name and some of the alumni, and of course, as everyone knows, a lot of famous and I felt alumni from Notre Dame that went there and are connected with Warren makes… We are, as I said, 14 years old. It’s about a 100-acre campus in Richmond, Indiana.


Probably about 50 to 60 minutes from the Cincinnati area, and we have an average… You usually keep a sense is about 55, 60 kids on campus that range from ages 70 to 18, 19 years of age, they come from backgrounds, a girls and boys at young girls, eight, nine years old who had to rework prostitution or kicked out of their homes or displaced or friends, they went through the system, they were involved in all kinds of human and drug trafficking at a very young age, so every adult that these youngsters had encountered in their life up to the age of whatever they are, 8, 90, 10, 12 years old, they have willed these kids, either totally, physically, and these kids really have nowhere to go, so they end up in the system and the courts in both Indiana, Ohio, Kentucky, they contact us and say, Look at this child here and so in so county, inhabitant County, for example, here in San and we don’t… Can you please come and assess them, so we have a team, clinical team that goes and assess the child, sees that a, this child can make sense for them to come on our campus, they come and reside on our campus, it could be… Depending on their situation, the shortest, a couple of months, up to a year and beyond, that they go through therapy, we try to get them educated at… They come with with so much baggage that sometimes we’re starting off with, and I always tell people Just imagine final rate, Tarzan Tarzan just from the jungle. No one’s taught this child how to comb their hair or brush their debate, and we teach them all these skills and you would think that the 1-year-old boy or girl, I automate. But some of these kids do not.


So we… We were trying from space with many of them, and we try to get them to the point when they leave our campus, they’re discharged, that they have some level of a normal life, whether they can attend the school, a public school, as opposed to our campus tutor. If they’re 18, 10 years old, they’re discharge. We try to get them a job.


A mark or a Robert. Those are Anna in your… You water… How do you feel like… What is it, vision? Long-term abuse, you have this facility in sin, you have to ask the right metrics and the people… Where is the expansion of… Where is the man outlier this organization excess… So yeah, my role specifically is in the philanthropy officer there, so it’s fundraising for our different needs, needs are always changing. It can be anything from bolstering our clinical department, we need maybe a raise from… We worked for… We own the land, we own our buildings, everything is by private donations, we receive a… No, I get the middle level premium from the state for each child, but we do… We really rely on people’s generous donations, so I work with foundations, Li for brands, work with private donors, we do different events to raise funds to keep the campus going from an operation standpoint, keep the buildings in good shape and in line with the CNC requirements. We’re trying to… We don’t have much in the way of athletic, so we have a gym and some groups for the kids to play, but physical development is so key and their progress and their overall development that we just haven’t done enough over the years because they’ve other priorities to put a sports program together, so now we know we’re working closely with… This is an in resisting bangles, different different Indiana Pacers, different organizations to get brands and funding to raise money, so we can put together a ten, think that’s really important to… You have to have that multi-expert approach where you have some leeches of these life skills, you have some of the other Sona development, personal-developed education, Alenia together continue. I think that that’s one of the things that I can… To often necessarily accomplish, there’s a lot of them that are very vertically focused where they work on one thing and one thing only, but it’s kinda nice that you guys have a very diverse offering that you bring to the table, ’cause I think that’s something that’s a little bit more effective than just… No one particular vertical.


Correct that, that is correct.


There’s just… The needs are always gonna change. Even doing this code, it crisis the… The expectation… And that’s a time I think that you guys do it. Flintstones reach out and that He… To a website or something, it… So and kind of find a guy, he understands the work, an SAE, and it’s kind of a blessing that we’re gonna be there to help these kids… Yeah, yes, absolutely. It’s www, Wardle.


And then all the tendon, the rage early org is our website, and anybody can go there, check to get to know us a little bit more. Anyone was interested in supporting and donating, they can do that right to the website.


In fact, work where we were right in the middle of the two-day concert A to raise money for any… We had a… So we have four groups perform yesterday, and we have a couple of groups and including the multi-cultural pop perform this evening, that they can tune into Facebook or a YouTube… You too, Charlene.


That’s awesome. And and to kinda wrap up the show for other people that are interested in your entrepreneurial mind and what you guys are doing over in the Middle East, what’s the best way for them to reach out for you? Is it email? Do you have a website for that business, what’s the best way that they can cater them, just… They can email me direct or call me, they can call me at five one, I think the best way is just give me a call and we can talk it through a 513-417-4039. again, that’s 513-417-4039, anyone was interested in speaking to me and saying what we left to get to know a little bit more about how business works in the Middle East, and we may even be interested in expanding.


That is one of the services that I offer is I have a local person I work with and in that region, so I… So we have a lot of people who approach me here in the US and say that we would love to expand our business, at least how do we do it? What is it in cost? And I can get them from soup to nuts, kite set up, if they have interest in it.


That’s awesome, and I wanna thank you for coming on the prospecting show. I know we talked about a lot of different kind of entrepreneurial things in growth and opportunities that exist there, so thank you for your time and walking and recitation us through it, and I hope the listeners got some good information there, talking about the US market, talking about the Middle Eastern Market in the healthcare space, and then also looking at some of the work that you’re doing locally here in the United States, and I think those are all super valuable, so thanks a lot for coming on the show.


Thank you, I appreciate that.

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